The committee finally succumbed to the pressure. As of October 1st, homeless will face trespassing tickets if they are at the City-County Building after meetings conclude on weekdays, and on weekends and holidays. After 3 hours of testimony and staff presentation that no new services were necessarily being offered, the committee decided there were tired of hearing about this, said it wasn’t their job, suggested churches should just take care of this and then voted with the mayor 7 – 1 to remove homeless from the City-County Building with no plan in place as to where they might go.
All this, despite the fact that the first statement was this:
Enis Ragland says that they have heard a lot of passionate testimony about the conditions and lack of services and resources that are available to homeless individuals and its very true, its true, there is a failure of government to provide mental health services, at the federal level down to the county level which has a responsibility for doing so and failure to provide alcohol and drug treatment and there is also a failure by government to provide services for the homeless, so I don’t argue against any of those statements that have been made in that regard.
Here’s the committee discussion. I will post video when it goes live, but it will be a while cuz I didn’t edit til this morning. Warming, reasons for voting this are as follows:
– Government has failed, but its not this committee’s problem.
– Groundhogs day, I don’t want to listen to this again
– We can’t do anything here, take your advocacy some place else where they can make decisions (ahem, read the description of your committee = Madison General Ordinance Sec. 33.09(1) (2/2014 – formerly 33.26) – Establish and maintain liaison between the Common Council and the County Board for the purpose of conferring on matters of mutual interest and to provide a means for advising both governing bodies on matters where there may be an apparent conflict or difference in interest between the City and the County. (Original Authorization: Resolution 5466, adopted 3-28-1963 & Resolution 54038, ID 21034, adopted 4-1-1997.))
– As long as the discussion stay at this committee nothing will happen
– We’ve failed and we can’t do anything about it.
Mary Kolas explains Enis Ragland (Mayor Paul Soglin’s office) has made the motion, seconded by Jeff Kostelic (County Executive Joe Parisi’s Office) to:
– Amend CCB Operating Rule 6.6, to read, “Loitering is prohibited. Loitering includes being inside the building or on the building grounds after hours without any apparent official City/County business.”
– Direct Dane County Facilities Management to place no trespassing notices (required by Operating Rule 2.2) so they can be seen on the outside of the building.
Kolar asks for discussion.
Enis Ragland says that they have heard a lot of passionate testimony about the conditions and lack of services and resources that are available to homeless individuals and its very true, its true, there is a failure of government to provide mental health services, at the federal level down to the county level which has a responsibility for doing so and failure to provide alcohol and drug treatment and there is also a failure by government to provide services for the homeless, so I don’t argue against any of those statements that have been made in that regard. There is also a back story to every statement of everyone who is testifying, how they got there and reasons for it and of course we hear the best of what they are saying. We hear the best testimony about what the conditions are, how they take care of each other and how its safe and all that and I’m telling you that it is not that way. There is intimidation, there is a group of people down there now that controls what goes on in the front deck, I’ve warned previously that about the danger of something happening and we had a stabbing (ahem, not at the CCB, but across the street, so this won’t solve that!) We are very fortunate that neither person was seriously injured but what are we going to do when there is a murder, are we going to say, well arrest them and lock them up and keep doing what we are doing. The Mayor was approached by two different people, one psychologist and on psychiatrist, and for the record they weren’t offering him services (laughter) but they basically said that when you create an environment outside of schizophrenics, when you create an environment where there are no rules for people with mental health issues and alcohol and drug issues, you do more harm than good for them, and that is what we are doing. We are creating an environment where we are exacerbating mental health issues, alcohol and mental health issues, where there are no rules and people can do whatever they please. And we see it on a daily basis. We here people saying we are criminalizing homelessness but then arrest the people who are urinating and dedicating in our courtroom, and washing their underwear in our sinks, arrest time, that is what they are saying, so they are contradicting themselves in that regard. (ugh, arrest people for bad behavior, not for performing life sustaining activities, really, its not that hard to understand) There is no control down there, there is nothing that is safe, people who are being banned from this building are being moved over to the municipal building. And we’re stepping up enforcement to prevent that from happening because we don’t want the types of behavior that are prevalent in front of our building on a daily and nightly basis to transfer over to the municipal building. There are people who say they are here and they are not afraid or they can do whatever they want to do but they are not here on a daily basis. They are not here on a weekend when it is one big party out front and people going to Monona Terrace are being accosted or threatened or yelled at and this is the behavior that goes on. They are not working here every day like the employees of this building and women who are pregnant have to walk through clouds of smoke because people don’t respect the rules of this building, they don’t respect the conditions that we work in. Its tragic that they don’t because there was a time when the behavior was tolerable, at one point some years ago, I am told, but not now, because there is no respect for the people who work and do business in this building by a significant number of people who are in front of this building. That is why we have to set up the rules, that is our responsibility, there are problems, there are issues, but its not our job to solve them on this committee, I know we do this in other parts of our lives, I know all of you, I know you do that, we work to do that, but our job on this committee is to address issues of the condition of this facility, the safe, health and welfare of the people who work in this facility and that is what we should focus on, we can’t focus on the failure of other folks or of the government in general not to do what needs to be done. We’re not responsible to fix everything that is broken, but we can fix what if broken at this building and what it broken in front of this building and that’s allowing an denvironment where there are no rules.
Supervisor Paul Nelson says this is a very difficult and unpleasant decision for him and a difficult and unpleasant vote, which was brought home to me last week when I got an email from Supervisor Wegleitner she thanked me for the support I offered to homeless as I had voted against this proposal 2 previous times that it came to a vote. She also asked me to be a co-sponsor of a resolution but as soon as I got the email I had to call right away and tell her that I am indeed voting in favor of this tonight. I think I’m coming from a little different approach so let me explain, this is the same thing I told Supervisor Wegleitner. We had a meeting of this committee on July 21st of last year, 2014, we had some very, very compelling testimony, mostly from homeless advocated, we discussed the issue and we voted against it 1 to 6. The we met again on June 6th, of this year, again we had lots of compelling testimony, mostly from homeless advocates, although this time there was a few more from staff and facilities, we had a discussion, we voted, and it was 4-4 and a tie means that it was defeated and tonight we had about 3 hours of very compelling testimony again, and the committee is in the process of discussing this and I think I see a pattern by now, when you take these three days, the pattern I see resembles ground hogs day. We just seem to be stuck in this discussion about what needs to be done, we all know what needs to be done, we need a day center, we need storage, we need much better homeless services, but to me, it just seems that it is unfortunate that so much of the public discussion that has taken place about homeless issues is taking place at this committee that only has jurisdiction for the block that the building sits on, (ahem, committee description = Madison General Ordinance Sec. 33.09(1) (2/2014 – formerly 33.26) – Establish and maintain liaison between the Common Council and the County Board for the purpose of conferring on matters of mutual interest and to provide a means for advising both governing bodies on matters where there may be an apparent conflict or difference in interest between the City and the County. (Original Authorization: Resolution 5466, adopted 3-28-1963 & Resolution 54038, ID 21034, adopted 4-1-1997.)) and homelessness is not just the City-County Building problem, its not just the City of Madison problem, its not just a Dane County problem, its a problem that requires all of us working together, if he was advocating, doing an advocacy problem, I would look at who really makes the policy and budget decisions, we can make referrals on this committee, but we don’t have that direct authority, so to me one of the reason I am voting is that we need to move this discussion off, away from this committee, put the ground hog day movie reels back in the box and move on. It’s useless to spin our wheels and at least to the casual observer it looks like we are not doing anything. He has been on the county board for 16 months now and at first it looked like we were very close to opening a day shelter on Martin St. and that fell apart and we seem to be actually losing ground. He feels as long as we have these discussions at this committee we are not going to be getting anything done, we need to move it to where policy and financial decisions are made. That is the reason he is voting for this, reluctantly, but part of me feels comfortable doing what I said. One more thing, what really helped bring me to this point was the testimony of the maintenance staff, some very difficult testimony, but some very clarifying and illuminating testimony that really answered some of the questions I had, what is the impact on staff, how much time are they spending as a result of the issues we have on the porch, those answers were really clear, not only on just what they do, but how they feel about their jobs, its just difficult for them and we’ve heard more from staff. We have an issue with homelessness, we have an issue with safety, we have a issue with health that is developing and this committee has to take all of those into consideration at this point, the tipping point came for me at that August 10th meeting, so he will be voting in favor.
Al Matano says that this matter is not properly before them, because Roberts Rules of Order assumes you take a final action on things and you don’t just bring them up for repeated votes.
Kolar interrupts and says she can address that or we can wait.
Matano says that this is not just a procedural issue, its an intent and it goes to the fact that after the last time we voted the mayoral aide said he had someone’s vote if it came back again, so it’s just gaming the system, its saying we’ll vote on this until someone cracks under pressure. So its not how we do business in government, its not legal, but he’s not prepared to file a lawsuit over it. He does empathize with the workers, he doesn’t think that the City-County building is as enjoyable, we used to take photos on the front porch of the city-county building when they were elected, but its a different place. It has been impacted by becoming the default shelter for the homeless. Nonetheless, I’ve hear the homeless described as being like a bird that has no place to land. If a bird had to fly all the time, and didn’t have a branch to land on, they would just flap their wings all the time until they fall out of the sky and die and the current mayor is wanting to bring that home. He’s waged, as some somewhat unruly visitor said today, he’s waged a war on the homeless. He walked by Philosophers Square tonight, there were stones, a sculpture there, and people sit on the stones. That was too obtrusive for the current mayor, we had to remove those stones so people couldn’t sit there. He got elected this time, its his third tenure as mayor, this time he was going to fight a war on poverty, well, that didn’t happen. He’s instead fought a war on the homeless and fought a war for the rich with Judge Doyle Square. On who’s watch did homelessness flourish the way it has.
Enis Ragland asks if this is germane?
Kolar says they are voting on weather or not to turn the signs. If you could take that up with other people and stick to the . . .
Matano says in the course of this discussion we heard language that the people affected by this are drifters.
Kolar says she doesn’t think they hear that tonight.
Matano says we didn’t hear that tonight, but I did hear that.
Kolar says that is correct, but if we could just stick to what we have . . .
Matano says ‘Mam, I can give my testimony and if you’re ruling me out of order so be it, but you berated all the citizens who tried to speak at our last hearing and I sat idly by instead of calling point of order then, I appreciate that you allowed people to speak tonight, and now your taking it out on me.
Kolar sits there smiling at Matano.
Matano says he doesn’t agree on the issues, I don’t agree that you have the right to tell me that I’m not allowed to speak.
Kolar sits there smiling at Matano.
He says he also doesn’t agree that they have a right to vote on this tonight, essentially we are saying that the least fortunate people in our society should go away, we haven’t provided they an “away”, we’ve gone down several blind alleys trying to find a day shelter, some of us on the county board have suggested we should increase the amount of money, we should move to a more likely location that would succeed, and meanwhile people are complaining that this building has taken the brunt of the lack of facility planning. He thinks this is an immoral proposal and was put forth illegally and if you’d rather I curtail my remarks, I will right now.
Kolar stares at him the whole time.
Kolar says that to address his concerns, each time we meet is a session, so per Robert’s Rules of Order its in order, its not like on county board where a session is an entire year. Each time we meet its a new session so we can consider this proposal this evening.
Mark Clear (on the phone) – Mr. Ragland used the word failure earlier and I concur with that, this situation is a failure and our solution of using the city-county building as a shelter of last resort is a failure and this committees actions are unfortunately a failure and there is no right answer and in this case there is definately no right answer, we only have wrong answers before us. But, the failures are not of this committees making or undoing. And I think one of the ways he is looking at this, if this were not the current situation and loitering was prohibited, and there was a proposal for lack of a day shelter and lack of sufficient shelter space and lack of a wet shelter and all the other failures we have, if our solution was to open up the front of the building, to allow poeple to sleep on the porch and lawn, that wouldn’t even be considered, because it would be a terribly horrible idea and it is a terribly horrible idea. And I think it was originally started because it seemed like the front of the CCB was a safe place to gather, and I think maybe for a while it was, but its not any more, its not safe for the people who are there, its not safe for the building, its not safe for the people who clean that area and maintain the building, and for those reasons we need to bring it to an end. He would support an amendment to set a date a which these changes would take effect, to take effect immediately, is inappropriate and we need time to give people notice that things will be changing. When I originally met with Mr. Ragland after our last meeting, I basically described what I hoped would happen between now and the next time we discuss this and that is that there would be a really strong, really interventional level of services offered to the people who are using the building as a shelter of last resort and I got largely conflicting stories about whether that has happened or if anything different has happened, although there has been a great deal of services offered already and unfortunately due to technical problems I missed the earlier testimony of Casey Becker at he start and I don’t have the benefit of that information. And I’m not sure how credible it would be anyways because of very conflicting bits of information. So we have a choice between two terrible situations and I think if we do close the CCB, to loitering and camping hopefully that will be a push that some people have needed to get into shelter or treatment or other option that is available to them. Some people may choose to to leave Madison, some people will choose to go elsewhere or have no other choice bu to go elsewhere, some will stay and perhaps if the people who stay are unobtrusive, there may be a sort of “live and let live” philosophy, I might be being overly optimistic, but its also clear that there has been an environment where people who wish to prey on the most vulnerable people in society have decided this is an opportune place as well and hopefully those people will decide to take their predatory ways elsewhere. He is goign to reluctantly support this motion but he would like to hear a motion to set an effective date, if not, he will make it himself.
Kolar asks Ragland if he would like to amend his motion. Ragland says that he would give people 30 days, from tomorrow. Kostelic the seconder approved it. The agree it would be October 1st.
Sheri Carter (president of the Board of Porchlight) says that this is also difficult for her for a lot of reasons. She thinks the providers that are providing services and opportunities for our homeless neighbors and residents are doing the best job they can with very little money and anyone who works in the nonprofit arena knows that there is very little money but we do the best we can. And sometimes we surprise ourselves by what we can do with very little money. The day shelter was proposed last year and they have ran into a snag and therefore we don’t have a day shelter right now, it is her hope they will get a day shelter. But I know that the front entrance to the city-county building cannot be the day shelter. One of the things about any shelter, is you ahve staff there, and for us to assume that you can self manage is not fair to everyone that sleeps on the front porch, that is not fair either. We have a committee that is restricted, by its realm and we have to look at the building, the employees in the building and that is basically where our kingdom starts and finish and she feels the solutions to this situation is going to be addressed at other committees that exist, that can actually help and put forth resolutions, etc. We do need affordable housing, the affordable housing stock is very low. One reason is because people are not moving up and out,once they get in they are staying in there. I’m not criticizing them, because she would stay there too, we know in the last 20 years, the situation economically has been a roller coaster so you’re not going to move up and move out, you’re going to stay in a safe place where you know you can afford that rent. We all know that most of us are living pay check to pay check whether we are admitting it or not. It’s just a matter of fact that we can all become homeless at one point in time or another. She believes that we should look at the churches and see if they will open up their lower levels, we have tons of churches here. This committee can’t make that happen, but the power of the people can, I know that for a fact. I started saying this was a very hard decision for me, I know many of the people that are staying on the porch, I speak to them on a day to day basis when walking past when I am going in the building and I don’t think its safe, and when the children started showing up on the porch – its one thing as an adult – but when if a family comes there, I don’t know if is safe for a family to be there with the other residents there, I have no idea about that. Its a very hard decision, but she’s going to support this because I feel that there are other committees within the city and county to address the homeless issue.
More on this tomorrow.
It passed 7 – 1 with Matano being the lone no vote.
