More than half the amendments went quickly, until the Edgewater reared its ugly head . . . and the mayor got cranky. With BK comments
AMENDMENT ONE
Library / No. 1 – Central Library, Planning and Community and Economic Development / No. 6 – TID 39 – Stoughton Road
Page(s): 8, 134
Sponsors: Mayor Cieslewicz, Alds. Clear, Verveer, Palm, ComptonOn the advice of the City Attorney, add the following language:
Central Library: “The City may internally borrow up to $8,000,000 from other funds in advance of collecting private pledges to facilitate the timely completion of project components paid for by these private contributions.”(This language clarifies current budget intent.)TID 39: “In addition, the City may advance up to $650,000 as a working capital loan from the General Fund to Madison Development Corporation to facilitate payments to contractors during construction. This loan will be fully repaid by MDC upon completion of project construction.”
General Obligation Debt: $0
Levy Impact: $0
Separation – Item One
Satya Rhodes-Conway moves separation of the item.
The first part, on the library passes on a voice vote without discussion.
Separation – Item Two
Rhodes-Conway SR has questions for Brasser, she asks about the precedent of lending a working capital loan to quasi-city related agency, have we done this internally? Have we done it to entities outside of the city?
Dean Brasser, the Comptroller says that MDC (Madison Development Corporation) is a private non-profit, but we have contractual relationships with them, it is rare we would provide working capital loan, we have with CDA and water utility, but this might be the first time.
Rhodes-Conway says that she is not comfortable providing working capital funds, we do have some loan funds and that is fine but uncomfortable with a budget note that would provide money to somebody, if we want to get into this business, and she is pretty sure at least one person would say we should not, if so though, we should set up a program and take applications. Next year will there be three budget notes? This is not appropriate and hopes they vote against it.
Julia Kerr asks Brasser to clarify what the working capital loan would be used for?
Dean Brasser says BioAg gateway and incubator, the city is partnering with MDC, they have substantial money from city and a federal grant, the federal grant is a reimbursement, so while construction is going on, someone has to be able to pay contractor and then ask for reimbursement, MDC does not have the resources to finance the construction or working capital during construction, so given the partnership, this would loan the money so they can pay the contractors installments. [One might ask, why didn’t they think of this sooner?]
Kerr asks if it is to deal with lag?
Brasser says working capital loan during construction.
Kerr says yes, then it is to deal with the lag.
They Pham-Remmele has a question for Brasser, if we approve that and can’t get the pledges then what happens?
Brasser says if MDC can’t get reimbursement from the federal government, then we would be faced with trying to collect form MDC and they would have to come up with the money, not sure how that would be resolved.
Pham-Remmele asks if we have staff to handle that situation.
Brasser says that we have substantial resources in our fund balance and this is a reservation of some of the fund balance and we commit to the loan just like water utility or CDA, we have the cash and investments available to make the loan, it would not present an immediate problem, we are taking some of fund balance and setting it aside.
Pham-Remmele says considering financial situation, fundraising not . . . and here I didn’t understand what she was saying, there was a side conversation going on, on the floor . . . if it cannot be collected and we advance it then we will be standing there holding the bag cuz borrowing the money first until the money can be in our hands, right, so in this way we are saying that we can borrow up to this amount, her question is what happens if can’t collect?
Steve King starts talking, his mic isn’t on, can’t hear what is going on, he is objecting to something Pham-Remmele is saying or doing.
Mayor Dave Cieslewicz says Cooley wants to speak, he has his hand up.
Tim Cooley, Economic Development Director says there are firm contracts with the federal government and city, this isn’t pledges, these are firm contracts. It’s just a matter of lag time with way EDA (Economi Development Administration) is set up, have to spend and then reimburse, this is being negotiated and finessed with the city attorney.
Pham-Remmele says thanks, she wanted some assurance.
Marsha Rummel asks what Cooley said, she didn’t quite hear.
Cooley says that there are firm contracts with EDA as with the city, they are not pledges as common in nonprofit or philanthropy fields, as long as they are performing they expect EDA to perform.
Rummel asks if he will guarantee that? Will they decide after we spend the money if they will reimburse it?
Cooley says he won’t personally guarantee it. He says working with MDC and as long as they perform they expect the federal government to perform also. He is not aware that EDA picking and choosing what they will honor.
Rummel asks if they pay up front and reimburse?
Cooley says that has been the policy for many years – that is what they did in California, it was the same issue. [Ok, like I said, if they knew this, why didn’t they plan for it earlier?]
Rummel asks if they paid for everything submitted?
Cooley says yes.
Judy Compton says that she knows they don’t want to hear her speak, she says that when we approved Twin Oaks, we fronted Habitat seed money to get going on purchasing the land, to qualify for the HUD grant and once they got the $1M they paid us back, those of you on council remember that was a long arduous argument from her, the only different was she was right, and I have to challenge you, we have done it in the past for private agencies – she says we promised we would have it up and running, this keeps getting put on back burner, not cuz we have 4.5M from the federal government and MDC will front us and build it cuz we have to have a nonprofit, you all understand how that worked, its not as easy as snapping our fingers, we are crossing hurdles in new territory and restrictions are coming up they were not aware of, this is necessary seed money, there is no doubt will be paid back, we have approved more money for other things that would not inject tax base into community this would inject, she asks you to approve, we can’t guarantee, but when the Federal Secretary of Commerce comes and hands us a check for $4.5M and calls it the Midwest Regional BioAg Gateway – the problem with getting it off the ground is us, lest create the jobs to increase our tax base and stop the exodus from the city so we don’t have to fight another budget like this. Trust me on this, this is a good thing, trust our economic development department, who knows what they are doing . . . as does MDC
Palm asks staff if this is similar to neighborhood grant programs, make neighborhoods spend money before we pay them back, so we pay mdc share?
No one answers specifically but there are nodding heard, so Palm says he assumes that is right.
Motion passes on a voice vote with a few audible nos.
AMENDMENT TWO
Agency/Project: Facilities Management / No. 4 – CCB – 201 Council Chambers
Page(s): 47
Sponsors: Alds. Sanborn, Pham-Remmele, ComptonRemove funding for the remodel of the Council Chambers Room 201 CCB.
General Obligation Debt $(200,000)
Levy Impact: (25,901)
Jed Sanborn wants to say a few words about his amendments, he says he tried to pick a handful of things to save real money for the city, also the ones that were the furthest from core responsibilities of the city, with the exception of the central park, they would not be noticed by vast majority of people, this one starts out with $400,000 renovation of this chamber, he agrees we should spend money to replace chairs and microphones, but no flat screen TVs right now, he gets the sense we are patting self on the back by only raising taxes 5%, average over 15 years is only a little over 4%, in environment where private sector and social security increase is zero, this is a flat economy and when we add that city raise taxes, with zero inflation, when mayor talks about 4% increase, well, he went back and looked in 15 years, it was 2.7% inflation, take that gap and compound it and you could make a good case we overcharged, its 16% higher than if followed inflation, like Washington, federal income taxes go up in 2011? There is widespread if not unanimous agreement it should not happen except at the highest levels, that means with our local government and the amount they have seen over inflation, they may pay more in local property taxes than federal income tax, we raised more than if Bush tax cuts were allowed to expire for everyone, we are raising taxes every year, our spending grows faster than the economy. These are real cuts and real money, $1.9M in cuts, not just in 2011, but for 10 years, the vast majority, 95 – 98% of Madison will not notice if they are gone. It starts with this, one of smaller amendments, do we need to spend 400K?
Pham-Remmele says that she agrees, if he didn’t start it she would, at this moment her borther in law is out of work, son is out of work, her neighbors the husband and wife out of work, another neighbor on Raymond Road, just got notice he was laid off, decent people struggling to stay with this community, the 97 year old woman in her district told her the United States has to pay off the debt or go bankrupt, cities and state have to cut back unnecessary spending too, this is just the family situation, her neighbors husband (when she told the story it sounded like she was talking about herself, but it was explained afterward to me that she was talking about her neighbor) stood on the toilet to fix a light and he broke the toilet seat, and she said we are broke, we can’t afford a new toilet seat, we can’t replace it now, we went out and (here i really didn’t understand what she was saying) we cannot afford a handyman. This is not the most comfortable place but we have heat, air conditioning and light, its a small amount, but not justifiable to pick and choose at this point, we can wait for another term, she thanks Sanborn for thinking of this, she whole-heartedly supports it, even if only one voted yes, please record her as voting yes, do not think of us, but Madison families.
Compton says that she is going to do a little history, so sit back and put your feet up – they say we need better chairs – she always gets the one that sinks to the floor – Verveer and MacCubbin were on the on city county liaison committee when they looked at the common council chambers, she asked what they were talking about, there is not enough money for services, this was uptown in her day, it was really fancy, she remembers when it was upgraded, she agrees with Pham-Remmele and Sanborn, this project was approved for some time, the county would not step forward with their change first so it was delayed and delayed and delayed, is this the time to spend the money? Can we make due? When they came forward they wanted to make the dais accessible so if chair or mayor who has special needs they can get on the dais, so they just cut off one of the podiums. Is it the most comfortable room? No. Is it adequate? Yes. We got a whole new sound system and city channel got new area to work and we were uptown with that and we were told that we should . . . missed what she said . . . she talks about the county board and says the swing the mics around, we don’t but the county does, they stand up and do this with their mics. She didn’t support it then, we can make due, this is like carpet in your house, if you don’t have the money this year, then keep in budget til have the money, she signed on cuz these are the tough decisions and we made them in other parts of the budget, this affects us and our comfort level and doing the job and what we were elected to do. She would like new chair, desk and microphone that works, yes she would, but not if not necessary, she will vote for it and against reconstruction even though she is the co-chair of City-County Liaison committee where it was was close to unanimous. She wants to do it, not this year.
Palm says do it or don’t do it, he’s been here longer than he thought he would be, does it impact how we do our business? No. The inconsistency of system is an irony since it is usually Pham-Remmele’s microphone that doesn’t work. This wasn’t paint and furnishing, the dais, sound system, energy efficiency, lighting, and that would save us money, substantial improvements not just cosmetic, he suspects that even if county approves the money, not sure it will happen. Go back to what Sanborn said, and his philosophy of spending money, it’s not like we are throwing dollar bills in a black whole and they are disappearing, they support jobs in our community, they would have trade union construction jobs, sales, some out of state, Sergenians would do carpeting, maybe that is a bad example but local, let not just look at in little boxes, if we cut $1M in spending we don’t save $1M the more labor intensive it is the more likely it will return to our community, whether this passes or fails it not a big deal but keep in mind and remind our constituents, that when cutting back then others lose the jobs and the cycle continues, when we cut back, less people will be employed and then the neighbor behind you loses their job, we can program and be smart, city is one of best government groups to invest in community, we make good investments, library and police station and we should focus on making those positive investments, they come at cost, but we should keep the broader perspective.
Cnare says that she is strongly opposed to renovation, its hard work, she just got done with it herself at her house, so she is opposed to all renovations. She asks staff, what is the renovation, is it fancy carpeting or accessibility?
Mayor has no idea and no staff are there to answer.
Compton says that Tim Satterfield (county board staff) knows, Alder king and Verveer can chime in if she is wrong, curtains for back windows, flat screen TVs hooked up to city channel so maybe Brad Clark knows the answer, we don’t have a plan, we are getting a plan drawn, accessibility, taking seats out, getting more room in another area, the plans not drawn up and approved. Desks are part of plan, not doors, sound system is.
Cnare asks if it is not to exceed 200K? Could we spend less?
Compton says that is our portion
Mark Clear apologizes to those sitting in inadequate uncomfortable seats in the gallery, disagrees this is adequate, might be for us able bodied, not for those with disabilities, the doors do not have accessible openers, someone has to hold door for you to get in, dais is not accessible, there are issues with where to park a wheelchair, one of reasons it is finally in the budget is that the county had a hearing on disability issues, it was a debacle, they could not move in the room and could not see the presentation because of the inadequate facilities, it is in the county budget and who knows how long that offer will be on the table, this might be time to make open and accessible for all the citizens.
Sanborn says if these are construction jobs or carpeting jobs, if that is the logic, the tear down the building and rebuild it (someone says “second”) he says if if we spend less of $400K then they can use the money to spend on other things locally, if you think this is economic stimulus I’d reconsider.
Maniaci asks what process will be in terms of design elements, plan put forward, can you speak to paneling, windows, granite, what is getting touched and what is not?
Compton says keeps getting kicked out of cue (problem with the sound system the money would go for), $400K won’t go far, won’t do too much, what it does will not be that visible except the screens, $400K to do a renovation or construction on a room like this won’t go that far.
Substitute Motion
Maniaci moves a substitute, hopes if friendly, leave language, wait . . . confusion . . . doesn’t have wording worked out . . . says she wants up to $200K to remodel, not to include replacement of paneling, desks, windows, and the granite, the amendment is to go back to what is in the budget, up to $200K in general obligation debt for remodel, not to include removal of council desk, paneling, granite and windows.
Someone seconded.
Mayor says he thinks it might be too detailed.
Cnare says she seconded it.
Mayor suggests they just vote. Then he says he may regret it, but he calls on Schumacher anyways.
Schumacher says he wants to make sure that we keep the clock in here.
Mayor calls for a vote.
Passes on a voice vote, with maybe 4 or so nos.
Back to Main Motion
Verveer says that served on the City-County Liaison Committee for years off and on, and he and King have additional perspective, he’d like to direct their attention to project 27 of executive capital budget, there is some detail about what it is for or not for, its to be ADA compliant, video screens for public to see presentations, energy savings with single pane windows, this is a reauthorization from last year. This project has been in the capital budget for several years, its been the victim to county lack of action. At Board of Estimates there seemed to be a strong will to find out why it stalled and to find out why it was not moving, they got it on the agenda, there were two meetings where it was discussed and King can read the minutes he is looking for, but reality is that $200K matching will not go far, it is a phased project, this is the bare minimums. The audio system is no longer manufactured, can’t buy parts, it needs to be replaced, its priority number one, we have learned that in the winter there is a tremendous loss of energy, the media row knows it cold back there, the blinds would be replaced, there are uncomfortable seats in the gallery, that is a later phase, bottom line is more of a priority. The fact that this is not ADA compliant is an embarrassment, it should be an outrage. The county is now taking request more seriously, Falk will unfreeze this project, this room gets a lot of use, takes a beating. It gets used by the County Board, Common Council and several committees plus the municipal court. He appreciates Alder Sanborn, he is a principled man and he hears him loud and clear but he respectfully disagrees, in terms of process, the last design and study is several years old, it only will move forward to update the study and City-County Liaison will make decisions but CCOC will be fully briefed as well.
Palm says he doesn’t mean the primary reason is economic development, its just one of the benefits, true economic development would demo the building, then assume spend no money, need middle ground somewhere, have to make conscientious decisions – this was in the 2007 budget, see the sticky notes up that are falling off, there is a post it note on the column, that is the last look at things to be done to look at the building, 2007 space study including glass curtain wall, $60K so not just curtain that was fabric, but a second layer of window so double layer for efficiency that would save us long term, arguments on both side, good to hear county moving ahead, agrees that video displays are not showing us what is going on, showing materials, now we either chop off mayors head (someone says “second”) if he was in his seat, his head is in the way of projection and the goal is to have council meeting and presentation and not have mayor move from position or have it at the same time, lots of presentations in today’s world, could get more info in power point, imagines that could have language proposed like Maniaci trying to come up with and put it to the board so we could all read along instead of trying to follow along, now he supports I after we talked so much, county is moving ahead, thinks its important for general public.
King says that 5 – 0 passed at City-County Liaison, the motion was to release funds for renovation, architectural drawings and cost estimates, audio visual replacement, gallery seating, ADA seating for public and nicer looking dais and windows for energy efficiency, we want city or county staff to do the architectural work, it won’t look like star trek, there will be two monitors so we can see, audio visual equipment will be for technology that has been around for years, the sound system is no longer manufactured, he says he is not indicating support or opposition, he want to talk about what is before us.
Mayor asks if that includes accessories, referring to the broken mallet.
Compton says she supported this at the City County Liaison Committee, she was talking about giving people work, this is $200K, how many are we cutting out of city employees that $200K would keep employed, they are improving something that is fine, not this year, this is not for forever, doubts they could plan for next year, think real hard. She joined this cuz she can’t in good conscience cut employees just before retirement and vote for it. It gives me guilt, its like going to buy a new prom dress and knowing the next door neighbor is wearing her grandmothers dress, she had to do something, Thuy does so many of these, she is voting on principle, not cuz don’t need it, the chain saw worked wonders here, maybe take it to the other side. She wants them to vote against this.
Mayor points out voting yes, because the motion is to cut the money.
Michael Schumacher says that at plan commission the often can’t see what is presented, he would prefer to have record of how we vote and speed up the roll call, would like to see it. When he travels, he often visits other city governments, ours is shabby, this is not just about ADA but pride, we need people to take us more more serious, also we spend the last half hour discussing this, imagine when talking about Overture. If you think this is long tonight, this will be really long when discussion of Overture.
Mayor says he was hoping to avoid the word Overture tonight.
King says this is the capital not operating budget, the levy impact is 25,901K next year, we are not saving the earth on this, capital is an investment, this was already delayed, the last study was several years ago, it was already delayed, he does not support or oppose, but wants to debate and approve or disapprove what is actually before us.
The motion fails on a voice vote, the no’s have it. I think Pham-Remmele, Sanborn and Compton asked to be recorded as voting no.
